An Encuentro Milonguero is being organised in the South of France from Friday 24 February to Sunday 26 2012. It's called 'mirame', 'look at me'(?). Close embrace is promised, with cabeceo and codigos, a maximum of 200 people, and male/female parity. We are promised everything in one place, 'warm as a cocoon'; residence, restaurant and dance hall. It's outside Castres, off the road from Montpellier to Nimes. Nothing is said about the floor.
The website is mainly in French. As far as I can make out there are some 30 4-room villas on site with kitchen included free, if kept clean. If all four 2-person rooms are occupied, a villa will cost €20.50 per person per night + €1.50 tax. A three-day pass to the milongas, including food, is €100 per person.
The organisers are Lalie and Pierre of the Association Access Tango, and the Djs are David Alvarez, Lalie Marion, Luigi Grieco and Myriam Alarcon. I've never heard of any of these, but I guess that's my ignorance. Better translations and more info welcomed.
13 comments:
I too have not heard of any of those DJs. And it must be said at the only Lalie-organised event I attended, the DJing was not good. That doesn't mean these ones won't be good, though :)
PS "Close embrace is promised". I am glad it is not. It is only proposed. Embrace is the choice of the dancers.
Your curiosity about the floor and other missing information awakened my own. Following an email exchange with one of the organisers, I understand that the dance floor is neither wooden nor tiled but a “pleasant enough plastic” [my translation] surface which will need to be liberally covered in talc. I also wondered about public transport arrangements for those coming from farther afield than Montpellier or Marseille; in response to this, there is now more helpful information available on the site under "situation".
Regarding the embrace, it is interesting to note that the organisers describe the event as “tango traditionnel en Abrazo fermé” [traditional tango in close embrace], which could be taken in good faith as either a promise or a proposal, be it vain or otherwise. Of course it is true, as Chris points out, that within the context of individual dancing pairs, the embrace is surely always proposed; nevertheless, it is interesting to speculate on the effect that organisers can have on the dancing and the embrace when they nail their colours to the mast in this way. Sounds promising.
Thanks for the info, Chris and Paul. Reaching Montpellier or Nimes isn't difficult as they are on the TGV network. But the floor... A 'pleasant enough plastic' - if there is such a thing! I assume that's going to mean a vinyl-covered floor, which raises the question of what the vinyl laid on. If it's on concrete, three consecutive nights would be very uncomfortable. On wood it might be OK, though not an ideal surface.
Ome must say that when an advertiser of this type of event doesn't mention the floor on the list of positives, that's usually because the floor is isn't a positive.
The plastic floors I have encountered have all been laid on concrete, which I think is no surprise since even nice plastic would usually only be used to cover something less nice - not wood. As you imply, TC, a plastic covering does little to change the fact that you are dancing on concrete - that's a nightmare for ankles.
And addition of talc, in my experience, just makes a difficult floor into dangerous one. I am grateful we don't have many milongas in the UK that talc the floor. I was dismlayed to find Carablanca using talc a few months ago, but they've not done so on any night I've been since. Long may that continue.
within the context of individual dancing pairs, the embrace is surely always proposed; nevertheless, it is interesting to speculate on the effect that organisers can have on the dancing and the embrace when they nail their colours to the mast in this way. Sounds promising.
Indeed. The proposal of close embrace is often a just a diplomatic way of saying "Nuevo not welcome".
Talc is occasionally necessary because from time to time humidity can make even a good floor sticky, at Carablanca and elsewhere. But it's regrettable that talc is necessary to make a poor floor danceable. & yes, vinyl is unlikely to be laid on wood.
"Talc is occasionally necessary because from time to time humidity can make even a good floor sticky"
I think that is largely specific to a certain kind of dancing. This is apparent if you note who it is that requests talc hereabouts. One very rarely finds talc on the floors of the often-humid milongas of BA.
Following a further exchange of emails, I can confirm that the plastic surface (probably vinyl) is indeed laid on a concrete substrate, which would not only be a “nightmare for ankles" but also a lot less comfortable for those of us who are card-carrying members of the DKB (Dodgy Knee Brigade, don't Google it!).
Talking of talc, however, I ought to be fair to my correspondent. He merely reported its occasional use at this particular venue by locals at non-tango social tea dances albeit with the implication that it would probably be used at the forthcoming event; however, the suggestion that the floor might need to be “liberally covered in talc” was just me letting my imagination get rather carried away by the powdery stuff.
“Talc is occasionally necessary.”
For what it is worth, my own experience of talc is rather mixed: I have the impression it helped a bit on a rough tiled surface, not at all on a poor vinyl one and made things slightly hazardous on a good wooden one. But all in all I am inclined to be pragmatic and see what local custom provides in the way of making a less than ideal floor a tad more bearable.
“ [The use of talc] …is specific to a certain kind of dancing”
“This is apparent if you note who it is that requests talc hereabouts.”
A thought-provoking observation but is it consistently reliable? I may be reading too much into this but surely not all these powder abusers are to be confused with those performance-junkies who feel compelled to test the patience of fellow dancers with their self-indulgent sequences of multiple stationary molinettes?
“When an advertiser does not mention the floor…that’s usually because [it] isn’t a positive”
This sounds like a useful rule of thumb for the discerning tango traveller but I wonder whether it is universally applicable; London’s Carablanca and Pavadita both boast of their wooden floors but the lack of such a mention in many tango venues in Benelux does not necessarily mean imply tiled concrete. However, where one is possibly committing to several days’ of dancing, it is something definitely worth checking.
The proposal of close embrace is often just a diplomatic way of saying, “Nuevo not welcome”.
Possibly but I also wonder whether it goes beyond this. I am no expert in tango semiotics but there are, after all, many gradations along the way from the sobriety of “milonguero” style (for want of a better word) to the space-monopolizing mannerisms of “nuevo”.
Too bad about that floor, makes me hesitate. The area is good, and the time of year, the price, and the other arrangements are excellent. I can appreciate that local social dancers have no problems with it, but that's probably not such intensive use.
Paul, many thanks for getting in touch with the organisers and filling in the details.
Hi Paul.
"“ [The use of talc] …is specific to a certain kind of dancing”
A thought-provoking observation but is it consistently reliable?"
No - hence that I wrote "is largely specific" rather than as you quoted.
""When an advertiser does not mention the floor…that’s usually because [it] isn’t a positive”
This sounds like a useful rule of thumb for the discerning tango traveller but I wonder whether it is universally applicable; London’s Carablanca and Pavadita both boast of their wooden floors..."
Well again no - hence that I wrote "when an advertiser of this type of event does not mention..." rather than as you quoted.
These Encuentros/Festivalitos are a very different kind of event, and can be inferior in ways not found in traditional milongas.
For example, a recent festivalito in south-west Germany held its main night in a church having the kind of dire acoustics that at each moment gives you the last five or six seconds of music sloshed together. This is something you don't find in a milonga because most free-choosing dancers would soon stop going there until it wouldn't be a milonga anymore.
One can often accept bad acoustics, floor etc. for just one weekend. But an event set miles away from the nearest alternative and requiring prepayment for entrance and accomodation makes it hard for dancers to quit if on arrival they find they really don't want to be there.
This is not at all to say there aren't also good festivalitos/encuentros. I recently much enjoyed dancing and DJing at the Denzlingen festivalito near Frieburg, organised by Minh. One just has to take more than usual care when selecting. And more than the usual pinch of salt when reading the blog reviews written by the organiser's groupies...
Factual information like the above from TC and Paul is most usuful. Thanks, both.
Wow! I am amazed! Now you even review and discuss events, that you don't visit or plan on visiting. Discussing the bad floor of an event, that has not even taken place yet and that none of you will actually visit... I am impressed by your deep insight!
As for our own FCA that C. so kindly mentioned (without having been there): There was a technical problem in the church, that was solved during the evening. We have used the church repeatedly as venue and the acoustics are actually quite good on the dancefloor. A temporary problem whatever sort can happen at every venue - even a local Milonga.
There is absolutely no need to "diss" the Encuentros and Festivalitos, that are in general very well planned events with a high quality of dancing. But I guess, none of you will ever visit such an event. Which is why you have to criticize them.
This is so pathetic.
Melina, sorry, but I don't think that's fair. Since all the info on that Festivalito was in French, I spent a bit of time to publish a summary in English. &, yes, I noted that nothing was said about the floor. At that point I was interested in attending: the prices are good, it's a good time for me, and I've heard from Andreas that there's good tango in that area.
But when it transpired that the floor is basically concrete, yes, I hesitate... What would you do?
Melina, you are mistaken. As I said, I have visited festivalitos. I have also visited the church I referred to. People can get an idea of the acoustics from this video.
But you're correct that I've not visited your event there. That's not just due to the acoustics. I don't much like events that feature shows from dance teachers, nor the kind of dancers that do. And I don't feel at all able to dance tango in a place of religious worship. I'm aware you consider your event to be tango dancing in a 'traditional setting', but for myself and most dancers I know, given what dancing tango is all about, doing it in a consecrated church is as anti-traditional as it gets.
However I wish you good luck for your next event, and hope you are spared the technical problems.
"This is so pathetic."
And I hope your work day tomorrow gives you less stress than evidently did today's.
Revisiting this post, I confess to being just a little taken aback by the tone and tenor of Melina’s comments. The purpose of the foregoing exchange was to provide useful information about the dancing conditions likely to be found at this event. It is surely reasonable to allow intending visitors to have some clear idea of what dancing conditions (floor, acoustics, travel connections) to expect before they actually commit themselves.
On the dance floor question, when I asked for clarification about this from one of the organisers, I received a courteous, honest and factual response. Just the way things should be.
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